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What does it really mean when it says "No more than two 4M courses will be considered for admis Options
andy91
Posted: October 19, 2008 3:36:35 PM
Rank: Frosh
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Joined: 10/19/2008
Posts: 23
Location: Canada
Hi, I'm an Ontario High School student and I'm in the process of looking for potential universities to apply to. I currently have these 8 grade 12 courses: English (U), Economics (U), Advanced Functions (U), International Business (M), Computer Science (M), Comm Tech (M), Accounting (M), and Calculus & Vectors (U).

In total, there are 4 University courses and 4 M courses. The problem is when I look at the admission requirements for universities such as Schulich at York, and Commerce at Queens, it states "No more than two 4M courses will be considered for admission or scholarship purposes," and "No more than two 4M courses may be from the same discipline," respectively. What does this really mean? I'm confused because I have more than 2 M courses and those Universities say no more than 2. Must I change those M courses so in total I have 6 U Courses and 2 M Courses? Help?!

Sources:
http://www.queensu.ca/admission/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=287&Itemid=78
http://www.schulich.yorku.ca/ssb-extra/bba.nsf/allwebdocuments/newbbaibba

Edit: IB is a M course, sorry.
capo101
Posted: October 19, 2008 3:40:32 PM
Rank: Senior Student
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Joined: 10/11/2008
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Location: ontario
hey i believe you are in good shape...all they are saying is that out of the top 6 courses you submit to the university...no more than 2 of those courses should be at M level...that being said you have 5 U level courses and 3 M level courses...therefore when applying for university you willl send your top 4 U level courses and top 2 M level courses.

Capo.
Wilfrid Laurier BBA '13
Future Eng
Posted: October 19, 2008 4:49:20 PM
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Of course you don't need 6 U courses, just 4. But you should drop 2 of your M courses because you are wasting your time when you could be working on your 6 required courses.
scarboro
Posted: October 19, 2008 5:35:47 PM

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Location: Scarborough,Ontario
Same Discipline
Judging by how ambiguous the word discipline is, I'm guessing they only look at the top mark from Comp Sci, Comm Tech,Business. (In my HS, all 3 belonged to the same department)
You can't have all of them in your average.

UTSG Honours B.Sc. Specialist in Biology, Major in Ecology & Evolutionary Biology '12
Propsie
Posted: October 19, 2008 5:56:58 PM
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This question is a tiny bit unrelated and certainly doesn't answer yours, but it made me curious - what are U and M courses? We don't have that designation in Alberta, at least not to my knowledge.
Future Eng
Posted: October 19, 2008 5:58:47 PM
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U are university courses and M are college/university courses. The latter are usually easier therefore some universities do not want you to have too many of them.
karla
Posted: October 19, 2008 6:03:23 PM

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Future Eng wrote:
U are university courses and M are college/university courses. The latter are usually easier therefore some universities do not want you to have too many of them.


I think in Alberta those would be considered our 'options'.
scarboro
Posted: October 19, 2008 8:47:33 PM

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Future Eng wrote:
U are university courses and M are college/university courses. The latter are usually easier therefore some universities do not want you to have too many of them.

Not necessarily easier, but more application/hands on based, rather than pure theory.

UTSG Honours B.Sc. Specialist in Biology, Major in Ecology & Evolutionary Biology '12
Kaylya
Posted: October 20, 2008 10:17:17 AM

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It means, they will not use more than 2M courses as part of your top 6, and in the other case, they will not use more than 2M courses from the same discipline as part of your top 6.

Queen's provides a link to how they define a discipline. Two of your courses are from "Technological Education" and 2 are from Business. Given that they require 3 courses, they could count 3 of your M courses, because no more than 2 are from each discipline. So your average there would be based on English, the two Maths, and your best 3 other courses.

Schulich will just include the 4U courses plus your best M courses, so your average there will be the 4 U level courses, and your best two M courses.



Ontario divides courses into (U)niversity, (C)ollege, and I think it's (W)orkplace (that I don't think gets offered at many schools and I might be wrong on the code). But then there's (M)ixed, indicating that it's appropriate for both University and College track people, and (O)pen, which is meant for everyone (Gym and Co-Op are two examples of O courses). So the universities take the U and M courses, and as shown here a few put some limits on the number of M courses they will take. M as we can see are generally not "core" courses.

A lot of schools in other places might look at it by dividing the courses into different lists. Actually, interestingly, for Alberta, Queen's just doesn't take a lot of the courses that sound like M courses, but then again, they only need 5 courses not 6.

FAQ's:
1. Will I get in? See: electronicinfo.ca for Ontario schools. If you have a couple percent above the marks there and it's not looking at supplementary, the answer is almost certainly yes.
2. Anything else: Google it before asking.
Propsie
Posted: October 20, 2008 8:36:16 PM
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karla wrote:
Future Eng wrote:
U are university courses and M are college/university courses. The latter are usually easier therefore some universities do not want you to have too many of them.


I think in Alberta those would be considered our 'options'.

Ahhh makes sense, thanks. Or electives or non-cores... do arts courses (i.e. music, drama) get the M designation as well, or do they have their own letters? (I'm just finding this all really interesting razz)
Future Eng
Posted: October 20, 2008 8:56:21 PM
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Propsie wrote:
karla wrote:
Future Eng wrote:
U are university courses and M are college/university courses. The latter are usually easier therefore some universities do not want you to have too many of them.


I think in Alberta those would be considered our 'options'.

Ahhh makes sense, thanks. Or electives or non-cores... do arts courses (i.e. music, drama) get the M designation as well, or do they have their own letters? (I'm just finding this all really interesting razz)


Music, drama etc. are all Open or Mixed courses.
luna_storm13
Posted: October 28, 2008 1:10:08 PM

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[quote=Kaylya]
Ontario divides courses into (U)niversity, (C)ollege, and I think it's (W)orkplace (that I don't think gets offered at many schools and I might be wrong on the code). But then there's (M)ixed, indicating that it's appropriate for both University and College track people, and (O)pen, which is meant for everyone (Gym and Co-Op are two examples of O courses)quote]

U,C, and E (workplace) levels start off as academic, applied and locally developed. My school offers a wide variety of workplace courses, as well as a specific program that can be entered in grade 9 that prepares you to head straight into working right after high school, Destination sucess. In my high school arts are generally M courses although some are U's.
M's are not necessarily harder than U's. for example I have a 4U math class this year which is far easier than a 3M history class I took last year. (keep in mind that I am horrible at math, and fantastic at history)
I don't understand why U, and M and such would be your options in Alberta. Does that mean that you don't get to choose anything other than the level of the class?

Nipissing Bachelor of Art History with Orientation to Teaching 2013
karla
Posted: October 28, 2008 1:48:53 PM

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I don't know what you mean?

We have our 'core' courses: english, social studies, math, biology, chemistry, physics

Then we have things like 'options': mechanics, foods, fashions, art, etc.

You have to take english and social studies to get your diploma, and there is a certain amount of sciences, math, and other courses that you need to take. At least grade 10 phys ed is also required, and career and life management (CALM).

There is no distinction between something like U and M, but there are more remedial courses for people who struggle in the courses. The 'pure' streams are number 10 (grade 10), 20 (grade 11) and 30 (grade 12). The remedial courses might have different number, like english 33 or math 24.

The Alberta diploma requirements: http://www.chinooklearningservices.com/HighSchool/AbRequire/AbDiploma.html
ECSTATIC.
Posted: October 28, 2008 1:55:24 PM

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here, i'll tell you smile U have four U courses, and four M. what uni programs such as schulich/queen's will do is that when guidance sends in ALL of your marks, schulich/queen's will take ALL of your four U marks and the 2 top M marks that you have. keep in mind that you can't choose what marks you send in. guidance sends them ALL in.

Schulich BBA 2013


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