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waterloo civil engineering or u of t architecture? Options
w-c
Posted: May 7, 2010 9:22:26 PM
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Im torn between the two, its not only a matter of leaving toronto for waterloo its also that i hear waterloo is a better school but my goal was to get into architecture, i know engineering is all science and math and architecture brings in design. but right now im torn
what do i choose? any advice?
sellavsert
Posted: May 7, 2010 9:38:49 PM
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if you want to go to architecture then go to u of t architecture. Architecture and civil maybe a little bit similar but they are still different fields. You learn arts in architecture and I don't know if UW civil eng has arts electives

another option if you really like engineering get your civil engineering degree first then do your masters in architecture

ncb
Posted: May 7, 2010 11:02:35 PM
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Agree....Undergrad Civil then Architecture....plus the Architecture school in UT has a higher reputation...

University of Toronto - Civil Engineering 2014

ERTW
Klukuska
Posted: May 17, 2010 12:40:27 AM
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Location: Hamilton
hey w-c i'm in the same position.
I'm debating between waterloo civil or the humanities arts & sci option at u of t.
Or potentially transferring from arts & sci to civil engineering at u of t:S
What have u been leaning more towards lately?
I'd appreciate some feedback.
Klukuska
Posted: May 17, 2010 12:44:48 AM
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Location: Hamilton
Oh and some advice that i could offer is that civil @ UW does give u 10 electives and there are some arts options to take which can be discussed with the faculty leader. I was looking at the requirements for the Daniel's admission into grad arch program at U of T and it requires 3 design courses, 2 arch history and theory, two in visual communication or representation, and two in architectural technology and ecology. that's a total of 10 which goes nicely with the 10 given in the civil program but the trouble is wether courses like these are provided:S
Let me know what u think if ur planning on grad school in archsmile
limes
Posted: May 17, 2010 1:13:59 AM
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Location: new west
like you said, theyre very different disciplines, where architecture is more in design and arts, but civil is more with the engineering aspect of buildings and structures.

personally im just about to finish 2 years of architecture school at a local college, and i just found out, that it wasnt my strong point. if you feel you are a very creative or artistic person, then id strongly suggest architecture. with that said, im not counting out architecture completely as it is still a very strong option for me later on if i choose to persue it in graduate school. but be ready for a long 7-8 years in school if you want to become an architect

as for civil engineering, which is what im currently trying to persue, is more math and physics oriented. if you are strong at that, then it'll probably be your choice.

in conclusion, it all depends on what you think you'd enjoy doing. doing the math and physics behind the building, or designing the aesthetics and alot of the aspects of architecture (lighting, structures, mechanical, and alot more)

hope that helped and ill be glad to answer more questions
jyl
Posted: May 17, 2010 3:02:08 AM
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I've been told by a friend who's going into architecture that U of T's architecture program isn't so great.

While I can't comment on that (because I haven't done the research), I can say for a fact that any engineering program at Waterloo is well recognized.


Still, no matter where you go, it's up to you as an individual to succeed. If you're passionate about architecture, then do it at U of T.

University of Toronto
Engineering Science (NΨ - 1T4)
Klukuska
Posted: May 17, 2010 4:35:17 PM
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Location: Hamilton
Thanks for the tips!
I know they are so different and i wish they weren't. There should be some sort of affiliation during an undergraduate program so you can see what your good at. That's where i'm stuck.
I'm sure i can handle the math and physics it just ends up being what program would give me the most opportunity and flexibility to change my mind if i so please.

In your opinion, would it be a good idea to do the civil @ waterloo and attempt a masters in arch at UofT? Or stick with the u of t arts & sci undergrad and go on from there. Also, does the four year undergraduate degree in architecture at toronto mean anything by itself? What type of work could be expected with just that degree?

Thank yousmile
Voltaire
Posted: May 17, 2010 8:46:05 PM
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ncb wrote:
Agree....Undergrad Civil then Architecture....plus the Architecture school in UT has a higher reputation...


You don't know what you're talking about. To get into grad. school for arch., you need to have a portfolio- this is why you absolutely must study arch. in undergraduate school, to make this portfolio. Civil engineering and architecture are nothing alike.

Carleton University- Architecture 2014
ncb
Posted: May 17, 2010 9:11:05 PM
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Location: Ottawa
Voltaire wrote:
ncb wrote:
Agree....Undergrad Civil then Architecture....plus the Architecture school in UT has a higher reputation...


You don't know what you're talking about. To get into grad. school for arch., you need to have a portfolio- this is why you absolutely must study arch. in undergraduate school, to make this portfolio. Civil engineering and architecture are nothing alike.

you don't have to have a arch. undergrad degree in order to apply for a master arch. program..... as long as you have a solid art background and the require courses, you can still get into it....

University of Toronto - Civil Engineering 2014

ERTW
Voltaire
Posted: May 17, 2010 9:22:34 PM
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Location: Ontario
ncb wrote:
Voltaire wrote:
ncb wrote:
Agree....Undergrad Civil then Architecture....plus the Architecture school in UT has a higher reputation...


You don't know what you're talking about. To get into grad. school for arch., you need to have a portfolio- this is why you absolutely must study arch. in undergraduate school, to make this portfolio. Civil engineering and architecture are nothing alike.

you don't have to have a arch. undergrad degree in order to apply for a master arch. program..... as long as you have a solid art background and the require courses, you can still get into it....


Don't you understand that the whole point of the BAS is to create the required material for a masters portfolio? There would be no reason for undergrad. arch.- it is VITAL and absolutely NECESSARY. No art class will allow you to create even close to the necessary material. Not to mention the architecture history courses you cannot take as a civil engineering student. You are delusional my friend.

Carleton University- Architecture 2014
ncb
Posted: May 17, 2010 9:24:59 PM
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Location: Ottawa
Voltaire wrote:
ncb wrote:
Voltaire wrote:
ncb wrote:
Agree....Undergrad Civil then Architecture....plus the Architecture school in UT has a higher reputation...


You don't know what you're talking about. To get into grad. school for arch., you need to have a portfolio- this is why you absolutely must study arch. in undergraduate school, to make this portfolio. Civil engineering and architecture are nothing alike.

you don't have to have a arch. undergrad degree in order to apply for a master arch. program..... as long as you have a solid art background and the require courses, you can still get into it....


Don't you understand that the whole point of the BAS is to create the required material for a masters portfolio? There would be no reason for undergrad. arch.- it is VITAL and absolutely NECESSARY. No art class will allow you to create even close to the necessary material. Not to mention the architecture history courses you cannot take as a civil engineering student. You are delusional my friend.

..............................

University of Toronto - Civil Engineering 2014

ERTW
Voltaire
Posted: May 17, 2010 9:27:10 PM
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Location: Ontario
ownt, gonna finish my english seminar now

Carleton University- Architecture 2014
Klukuska
Posted: May 17, 2010 10:51:35 PM
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Location: Hamilton
okay:S
well i know and understand that you need a portfolio for the masters program, and it is possible to take fine arts courses during the civil program.
I'm not sure where you're getting at voltaire, are you telling me to forget about the civil and do the undergrad @ UofT because it will provide me with the portfolio pieces?
By the way the only course that is required is a semester of Architecture history.
I'm just looking for guidance that's all.
Voltaire
Posted: May 18, 2010 3:16:50 PM
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Once again- there is a reason that undergraduate architecture exists- that is due to the fact that it allows you to think critically as an architect and create models/ renderings that you would need to put in a portfolio for masters programs. Fine arts is nothing like a studio course in architecture, and civil engineering sure the heck wont allow you to do much more than test soil and concrete. Less than 20 students at any given time are in a masters program in architecture- you guys are delusional to think transferring from civil to an m.arch or even b.arch program is simple.

What you guys are saying is like someone who has taken engineering and wishes to go to medical school- of course it is theoretically possible, but you will most definietly be defeated by individuals who are taking pre-med programs.

Carleton University- Architecture 2014
GreenFreakk
Posted: May 18, 2010 5:36:28 PM

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Uh Voltaire Premeds actually have the lowest MSAT scores going into medical the top three scores were Biomedical Engineering, Physics and Electrical Engineering you don't need a pre-med to go to med. in fact it makes more sense to go into engineering because it gives a stronger fall back than pre-med. Same with law, pre-law and criminology students have the lowest LSAT scores and again it would be better to have a strong fall back like engineering. I am sure having a civil engineering degree with the appropriate prerequisites will prepare you for a masters in architecture while giving you a strong fall back in the case you dont get in.

here are the links for the stats i gave you if you dont believe:

Med: http://www.slu.edu/colleges/AS/physics/mcat2003.pdf

Law: http://www.uic.edu/cba/cba-depts/economics/undergrad/table.htm

Applying to:
University of Waterloo Environmental Engineering
University of Toronto Civil Engineering (Specializing in Environmental Engineering)
Queens University Geological Engineering (Specializing in Geo-Environmental Engineering
Voltaire
Posted: May 18, 2010 6:42:53 PM
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It's not the same with architecture, you need a portfolio to get into masters and civil is an engineering- not a design- program- there is a significant difference.

What I meant by premed progs. are progs. like biochem and biology, not a specific premed program. If you would realise one thing- those individuals in progs. such as electrical engineering have plenty of electives to choose from, meaning they are able to take biology and chemistry courses and thereby preparing themselves for MCATS. This is not comparable for architecture due to the very nature of what a portfolio entails.

If you are an architect, you sure as hell aren't an engineer. If you are an engineer, then you sure as hell aren't going to have the means to create a competitive portfolio. Do not argue this- you are mental if you even dare to step into this territory- you don't know what you're talking about because clearly, you have never seen the projects arch. students undertake and the time needed to create them.\

Architecture students easily spend twice the amount of time as any other undergrad. student (in school, that is, not outside of class hours) working on projects. Don't insult everyone who is in/ will be in BAS programs by saying anyone can get an m.arch. If you cannot get into a BAS program out of high school in the first place, then you sure shouldn't go into architecture at any further point in your life.

Carleton University- Architecture 2014
sellavsert
Posted: May 18, 2010 7:10:39 PM
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I don`t know anything about applying for master of architecture program but I have found this (interpret this any way you want):

The professional MArch is a 3-1/2-year program for individuals who have completed a 4-year bachelor's degree (in any discipline—BA, BSc, BASc, BES, BFA, BCom, etc.) with a final year average of at least mid-B from the University of Toronto or its equivalent from a recognized university.

Applicants to the John H. Daniels Faculty of
Architecture, Landscape, and Design must submit a
portfolio containing:
A curriculum vitae (resume)
A statement of interest in your proposed field
of study, educational objectives and career
orientation
At least three (3) samples of writing from
previous university courses or published/
professional writings
At least five (5) samples of your design work,
drawing or work in related fields (including
the visual arts, graphic arts, digital media and
engineering) which demonstrate your creative
ability.

P.S. Engineering have a very limited no. of electives most of those electives are called technical electives which are still related to engineering. Other electives are in social sciences and humanities

GreenFreakk
Posted: May 18, 2010 7:19:39 PM

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Nobody is bashing a degree in BAS i'm just saying it isn't a long shot to go from bachelors civil engineering to a masters of architecture. anyone who has the prerequisites, the portfolio to match when applying to the masters of architecture program has an equal shot.


Applying to:
University of Waterloo Environmental Engineering
University of Toronto Civil Engineering (Specializing in Environmental Engineering)
Queens University Geological Engineering (Specializing in Geo-Environmental Engineering
Voltaire
Posted: May 18, 2010 9:54:42 PM
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No they do not.... For a typical 4 + 2 year masters program (such as Carleton's), it is next to impossible to get into if you have not attended an accredited undergraduate degree in architecture due to the necessity of architecture fundamentals. Of all accredited universities in Ontario who offer M.Arch, none have any other offering than the 4 + 2 or similar program... Waterloo for example lists these prerequisites for entrance into M.Arch....

•A four-year honours undergraduate degree in pre-professional Architecture or professional Bachelor of Architecture degree with a minimum overall average of 75% (B).
•Two letters of reference, from academic sources (referee is contacted by email and the referral is submitted electronically)
•One official academic transcript from each post-secondary institution
•A CV/resume
•A one-page statement of research interest
•Proof of English Language Proficiency (if applicable): A score of at least 600 is required in the Test of English as a Foreign Language (TOEFL). (See English Language Proficiency for other acceptable tests of English.)
•Where applicable, a portfolio

And for Carleton...

Where applicants do not hold a B.A.S., but hold a four-year undergraduate degree with a concentration in architecture, equivalence may be considered on the basis of a demonstrated, exceptional design ability and high academic standing (B+ minimum average). Applicants are required to submit a complete portfolio of their most recent artistic and design work produced during their undergraduate studies and two examples of academic writing. Professional experience may also be taken into consideration. A Qualifying Year may be required. Click here for more information on Qualifying Year.

What Carleton is insinuating is the fact that individuals who do not hold a BAS are simply incapable of producing a relevant portfolio and do not have the required knowledge.
Waterloo is simply denying anyone who hasn't completed BAS.

What now? Don't troll me, I know what I'm talking about. I have dreamt of and will succeed in becoming an architect.

Carleton University- Architecture 2014


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